Hillary, please,

[maevele]

just stop already. Sure, it sucks, but you can't win, long run. Yeah, part of it is sexism. and that sucks, but bullying the super delegates won't end sexism. but part of it is that Obama is just the better fucking candidate, and the republicans don't have the kind of ammo on him that they have on you and Bill. You're hurting the party, and increasing the chances that we won't get any goddamn democrat in this year. If we get stuck with McCain because you don't have the grace to do what's best for the country, I will hold you responsible, Senator Clinton.

Comments

[randomposting.livejournal.com]

I agree entirely.

[azzy23.livejournal.com]

I get where you're coming from, but if people vote tardly, it won't be her fault. She's still in the race because people keep voting for her. When she leaves the race, people will still be left with the same choice they have now; republican or democrat. If they choose to vote for a republican, for whatever reason, it's their choice.

By the same token, if Obama is such a strong candidate, he'll still win the general.

One of the reasons there's so much dirt on her is that she's been around. He hasn't been around as long, and the media has (thus far) refused to actually question anything about him. This is a bad thing, and will flip during the general election. What I'm saying here is, that if he loses in the general election, it'll be just as much his fault as hers.

Last thing, she's around 100 delegates behind. Though it is highly unlikely, it is not impossible for her to take 60% of the remaining delegates, especially if they seat Florida (which it appears they will do). You're forgetting that open races like this one don't usually end this early. Her husband didn't get the nomination until June, and faced similar challenges. She's known for being resourceful, and I think she's counting on a last minute flip. Like I said, it's probably not going to happen, and it will BLOW MY MIND if it does, but the rules say she can stay in. The DNC could make her withdraw, but they won't because they're not sure either.

I think Pennsylvania is going to end it, but we'll see.

[edit] oops. Forgot to mention, the presence of both Clinton and Obama in this race has energized the party to such a degree that it's breaking the records in *every* state. The democrats are tripling the turnout of Republicans everywhere, and even Clinton is raising 30 million dollars + every month. Obama and Clinton will probably top 100 million for March. Heck, she raised almost 4 million in 24 hours after the 4th. While it seems bad and divisive, it's actually waking people up and getting their attention.... and that may be the best thing that's ever happened to the DNC.

[morpheus0013.livejournal.com]

You just wrote the most sane thing I've seen said about the Democratic primary race in...well, ever, I think.

[azzy23.livejournal.com]

*blush* Why thank you. And here I thought I'd solidified my reign as the only one who doesn't think Obama's all that.

Don't get me wrong, I think he's pretty excellent, but I don't believe he's totally clean, and I like Clinton's healthcare better. *shrug*

[azzy23.livejournal.com]

One more thing. Another one of my psychic predictions here.

If there is a last minute flip, and Clinton wins the nomination fair and square...? *Nobody* will give her the love. The media will have a lot to say, but none of the really fanatical Obama supporters will accept her fair victory. Scads of Kos stories talking about how dishonest her campaign was, etc etc, farfetched tales of voter fraud on a scale so ridiculously huge as to be factually impossible will spring up all over the place. And the worst part?

A huge chunk of them will vote for Nader, thus demonstrating their fundamental ignorance of how the American political system works.

I've seen 4 types of Obama supporters:

1) People voting based on race because they think it will do more to elect a black man than a woman
2) People who want to believe hope can change the world, and think Obama is the guy that can focus that energy (and bless these people, because I've missed them for the last 8 years)
3) People who examined both candidates, and prefer Obama on the 2% of items where they differ
4) Fanatical nutbags (I've dubbed them 'Obamatards')

For the 1rst group, I can't look a black man or woman in the eye and tell them their choice is wrong, because as a white woman, I have no concept of what it means to be black in America. I can't say that to them, because I would be wrong. Putting a black man in office would give them a shining example that they ARE equal, that ANYTHING is possible, even if your skin is dark. I cannot take that away from them, even if I disagree with it personally, from a political standpoint.

The 2nd group I can understand too, because those people have been so beaten down by the lack of hope, so minimized by the sad state of our govt. I understand hope, and the desperate need we have for it right now, but hope isn't what drives me. I have it, but it isn't how I choose.

The 3rd group I respect, despite disagreeing with them. They've chosen rationally based on what's really important to them. I personally think they're doing it right.

The 4th group needs to die in a fire. Srsly. Just in a fire, with the dying. More people have lost interest in Obama because of these a-holes... I know Obama supporters that hate these guys. They praise Obama for taking the high road, but see no problem with wallowing in the muckiest of the muck themselves. They justify blatant sexism, and some of the nastiest things I've read, by saying simply that where Clinton is concerned, it's all true. It's okay to call her Nurse Ratched, because she is a castrating bitch. And they know *NOTHING* about Obama's history or platform. They simply hate McCain, and hate the bajinga, and so chose Obama. The fanaticism comes from not wanting to be called on their crap. Self reinforcing bull. And they're mostly white guys between 20-35, and white women under 25, who think "female empowerment" means the freedom to show their boobs to strange men at bars. Suck ups, basically.

[maevele.livejournal.com]

My worry is not that she'll weaken obama's chance in the general, because I believe that if hes he candidate, he's about got it. I'm worried she'll keep pushing, get the nomination, and then she'll lose to McCain.

If I thought she could take the Whitehouse, I'd be cool with this dragging on til the convention, and I'd take either candidate.

[azzy23.livejournal.com]

Well, here's the thing. The only group she's going to have trouble with is white guys between 20-35. Entitled jerk-offs, essentially, who think she's naggy when she gives speeches. *shrug* If she does get the nomination, those guys are going to have a choice:

Vote for McCain, and all the evils the Republican party will perpetuate, or vote for her and at least find solace in the fact that she won't go against the party.

Another thing here? If she gets the nomination, she will absolutely want Obama for a VP. That's what all this speechifying is about. She's essentially holding on to hope for the nomination, and trying to communicate to him that if she does get it, there's a place for him too. Obama has not said he wouldn't accept it, just basically said he doesn't get why she would ask him... but frankly, that's total posturing (and essential posturing, by the way). Obama is not an idiot, and he knows that as a VP he can still get a lot done, and what's more, if she serves 1 or 2 terms, and is done, *nobody* will *ever* be able to beat him then. That man with 4-8 years as VP under his belt? It's a done deal.

Think about that for a minute... Clinton for 8 years... Obama for the next 8. The potential to have a democrat in office for 16 years....

Sorry... I think I just cried a little...

[maevele.livejournal.com]

I'm honestly worried about the people whp probably wouldn't have voted, but they dislike her enough based on history to come out and vote McCain just to vote against her. Which is probably not statistically significant compared to the numbers of democrat leaning folks who don't usually vote but are coming out this time just because it's exciting.

[azzy23.livejournal.com]

well, if everyone who voted in the primary voted again, we'd kill the republicans, regardless of who the candidate was. The party is totally apathetic right now.

I agree with Clinton. Obama and Clinton on a dual ticket is absolutely unbeatable.

[morpheus0013.livejournal.com]

I disagree with pretty much every word you wrote.

Then again, I truly believe that the supporters on either side are doing way more fucking harm to "the party" than either candidate is doing themselves.

[maevele.livejournal.com]

I just don't think she can beat McCain. Between the sexism in this country, and how much some of the Republican base still hates her husband, I think she's defeatable. And I can't help but think it does real harm to the party when she implies the republican nominee is a better choice than her dem opponent.

[armchairshrink.livejournal.com]

i'm with this