she was cuffed to the truth

it just bugs me that they needed to girly her up at all, as she's abut exploring, not prettifying. i liked her as a 7 yr oldwho gave not a shit for fashion.

From:

shemale.livejournal.com

i do like the hairstyle; it's nice

From:

flourish.livejournal.com

I think what ticked me off most wasn't the outfit (it's not perfect, but whatever) but all the femme bows and flowers and so on. And the hair and shoes. I could live with the femme stuff if she had her hair in a braid and tennies on, OR I could live with the hair and shoes if she wasn't so femme, but both together makes me want to hit things repeatedly.

From:

I don't mind the outfit. My eight year old would probably heartily approve of the change, since to her Dora has slipped into the realm of "For Babies".
She likes the 'girly' stuff, which is not my choice of thing to rail against at the moment.

*shrug* It's for her, so I don't have much of an opinion beyond Just Don't Lighten Dora To The Point Of Is She White?ness.

From:

I guess i feel like girls who re into the girly thing get plenty of media images to reprsent them, but dora is almost all the tomboys get.

From:

Not all girls into the girly thing get representation. I have to scour stores and put in backorders for dolls that aren't just 'dark beige' for mine. There also aren't that many cartoons/shows with clearly identified African American girls in major roles.

If I'm missing some explosion of representation, I'd like to be pointed in the right direction for it, because I am all for saving myself some frustration.

From:

That's true, and I'd be a LOT more pissed of they had whitewashed her.an I guess having a role model that shows adventure and girly things aren't mutually exclusive is cool.

From:

trinityva.livejournal.com

Yeah, I feel torn too. On the one hand I like the idea of girls learning that it's OK to be girly AND adventurous. On the other hand I also really like a popular female character not being girly.

Meh.

From:

double replying because it's my lj and i can.

I just also feel like they could have kept her as one of the few role models for kids who aren't beige, without making it seem like it's inevitable to girly up once you hit a certain age.

I've been getting pissed about the princessifying of Dora for a while, and what really sucks? is that there's only the one damn cartoon girl of color who also is one of the only female adventurers/tomboy types, so we have to look for representation both for our tomboy girls and all little girls of color from the same damn character.

I really had only thought of it from the point of view of "can't we keep onre damn femaler character who wasn't a princess?" and independant from the "where the hell are the princesses of color?" issue.

From:

In all honesty, do you not think you'll get a white tomboy prototype before there's another major character of color that's as popular as Dora?

I see your point about the "Pricessification" of her, but I think it's slightly disengenous for whites to get up in arms about a change to make an additional character that represents the girls that look like Dora in a certain age demographic without addressing the lack of characters of color for them to see in first place.

From:

FTR, at the time i posted I dd not know this was an addition separate from the original dora show.

And I've been pissed about the lack of characters of color in hldren's programming about as long as I've been pissed at the lack of girl characters that aren't princessified. Because damn, 15 years ago it was almost impossible to find cool stuff to share with my nieces that in any way represented them. I could, if I looked hard, find empoweredish female characters, but finding characters that weren't white was nearly impossible. And trying to find an empowered non-white female character when they were little? no fucking way. There was black barbie. and specialty dolls. but watching a show or taking them to a movie where the leads spoke to them, nope. so I get what you're saying.

From:

A lot of us got up in arms before knowing she was an additional character. It hasn't been mentioned anywhere I've seen but this post. But that brings up a new question, if the new Dora gets an entirely new cartoon of her own, why is she still Dora? Couldn't she be Dora's long lost cousin? Without knowing both cartoons would be running at the same time, it wasn't to farfetched to believe that the new Dora would be replacing the old one.

From:

What other cartoon chases their market? In 30 years will Dora be an aging house wife?

Lisa Simpson has been 10 years old for 26 years!

Cartoon characters don't change. That's the benefit of being a cartoon character.

When Dora was invented, they were trying to do something different, a puggy, latina girl in shorts and a t-shirt. Now they are just backtracking. They may not have made her white, but in every other way she's been assimilated.

There are more than enough pretty Princess role models for older girls to emulate. There was one Dora, and now that's gone.

From:

I can't say that there are "more than enough pretty Princess" role models for girls that look like my daughter. If you know where I can find a plethora of them, I'd be more than happy for the link.

From:

Are you really trying to argue you are afraid society is teaching your daughter only white girls can be prissy?

From:

I'm saying that if you are going to argue that there is a wealth of dolls/characters/role models for African American girls to draw from besides the usual three Barbies and that one Bratz doll (I think there's a new Disney Princess - finally) then I'd like to see it.

I'm saying that I'm just happy that there is a non-white *Popular* character of any type available. I've been a parent that's had to find these things for nineteen years and it hasn't exactly been a cup overflowing with choices.

This isn't my journal, so don't don't start some strawman shit I'm not in the mood to finish.

From:

I'm starting strawman shit? You are the one that added "African-American" to what I said. I said there were already tons of Princess characters out there. You are the one that added that they had to be Princess characters of color to count.

I think it's a shame there aren't more images of girls of color of all kinds in television. But that doesn't mean you steal the role model for one type of girl to fill that void. It means you make new ones. Cause for the handful of black princess characters out there, there are fewer girl characters just being themselves.

From:

The African American part was there from the moment I said "looks like my daughter".

If you don't know what that means, then you shouldn't have jumped into telling me what is and isn't available./done with this and you

From:

You didn't say "looks like my daughter" until AFTER I made a point about there already being tons of characters.

I think it's incredibly selfish when someone brings up one injustice, to go, WELL WHAT ABOUT MY INJUSTICE. I think both are wrong, you are okaying marginalizing girls that aren't like your own children, as long as your own children get more representation.

From:

Look.

You were presumptious in your tons of characters statement.

I'm pointing out that I can't be arsed about sparkly dresses when I can't even find things that include my kid in the broadest sense of inclusion.

That you need to try to make it into a thing about oppression olympics when you just didn't state facts about the reality for girls of color is your issue.

Yes. I am totally inclined to think about my children and put their needs in the forefront.

That's. What. Parents. Do.

Last comment on this because maevele doesn't need Somebody Trying To Tell Me What My Concerns As A Parent Should Be When They Don't Even Know What Those Concerns Are in her journal.

From:

I wasn't trying to tell you what your concerns as a parent should be. I was trying to have a rational discussion about the media images portrayed to young girls. You are the one that decided to take it personally and get angry and rude. Do you always behave like this when someone disagrees with you or are you having a bad day?

From:

I'm an Angry Black Woman.

It's what I do.

Bye.

From:

Was there really any need to pull the race card? When someone calls you on your rudeness maybe you should examine the your behavior which has nothing to do with the color of your skin.

From:

See this?

There are more than enough pretty Princess role models for older girls to emulate

That was the first race card put on the table with your Disconnect From Reality Fail.

Or maybe you weren't defaulting to white, you just actually believed that mess.

Either way, talk at someone interested in your flailings behind putting your two cents into a subject you clearly know little about.

From:

Yes, I said OLDER girls. I never said there were plenty of princess role models for BLACK girls. Though I think there should be. I wasn't defaulting to white or black, I was just thinking of princesses. As this wasn't a topic about how many feminine characters of color are on TV, opposed to how many asexual female characters are on TV. You are the one determined to somehow make this about you.

And I'm jut curious, what subject do I clearly know nothing about? Parenting? Cartoon Characters? Black people?

From:

Older girls

Non white girls

Not mutually exclusive.

Dora is a non-white character. You can't talk about her and say "it's not about non-white character representation" because it doesn't fit the narrative of the discussion you want to have.

This isn't about me. This is about people complaining about a change to a character (an additional character at that) that ignore the fact that there's a lack of CoC in the first place for certain age groups.

Obviously, though - you know that.

From:

That's like getting mad about animal rights in a discussion about pollution. Yes, there is more than one problem in the world. But mentioning one doesn't mean we are ignoring the others. Had they lightened her skin, we'd be all over that too. But that's the ONE thing they didn't change.

From:

now that you mention the shoes, OMFG the shoes. Explorers wear stompy boots, or sneakers. Dora rocks because she works as a role model for tomboys, and has cross gender appeal. Boys, demographically, will NOT watch the new dora, whereas she was a longtime favorite of HQ's, I'd bet you money.

From:

They really screwed the pooch on this one. How is she supposed to trek through the rainforest in those shoes?

There are places for little princesses with emerald chains and pearl earrings. Hikes aren't one of them.

And looks like she lost some weight too.

From:

kittikattie.livejournal.com

And looks like she lost some weight too.

More often than not pudgy preschoolers become lanky kids.

From:

I know. But did she ever have to become a lanky kid? Was changing her at all necessary except to simply be like everyone else?

From:

kittikattie.livejournal.com

I don't see the problem. This one is going to run concurrent to the other.

Dora's not the Highlander--there can be more than one.

From: